Matching Bank Payments to Dividends

Question asked by Peter Halton 9 years ago

Used the new dividend facility to declare a dividend and calculate for all shareholders (which is useful). But when I try to import bank statement the dividend payments can't be matched. The only option is to create a new (purchase) transaction which will double count the dividend. When I used to create dividend entries individually (before the change) the import facility could match the payment to the dividend. What do I do?

12 Replies

Hi Peter - just to give you background to this.

You've hit on a clash between accounting law/regulation and what's easier for the person keeping the books. Under accounting regulation and standards "Trade creditors" ie unpaid bills, should, as the name suggests, relate to sums owed to other businesses, ie those who supply goods & services to the business. This isn't only for the purposes of year end accounting but also, when analysing how a business is operating, it's valuable to be able to differentiate trade debts from non-trade debts.

Depending on how you configure your CB accounts, when you look at the Trade creditors report, not only will you see these trade debts but you'e also likely to see unpaid bills from HMRC, for VAT &/or PAYE as well as unpaid bills from directors & employees for salaries &/or expense claims. Consequently, when the annual statutory accounts are prepared these non-trade debts have to be split out into separate pre-defined categories of creditors.

Typically, accountants do not like having to do this plus, as I said, they prefer to see debts properly differentiated generally, and so, to assist in this, there are actually toggle features that stop VAT returns and employee expenses from generating bills.

So, when the dividend tool was re-written, to correctly create a company wide dividend and also suitable paperwork, a decision had to be made over whether to retain the old bill creation or mimic what happens with the expenses toggle and generate individual creditor accountants for each person. Of all the things that are not trade creditors, dividend declarations are at the top of the list and so it was decided to treat them outside that area.

I do realise that this is annoying as it's great to have just one place to go to to see what the business owes day to day, but accounting software should really help the business comply properly with regulation and, as John says, if you want to replicate what happened in the past, create a bill for each person's dividend and point it at the new dividend creditor account.

Just in case it's of any help. In my and my clients' books, if the shareholders are also directors we tend to use the director's loan account (in the bank screen) to pay off anything owed to the director, be it dividends, salary or expense claims which effectively moves everything owed to the one account and then, any payments to the director out of the main bank account are just treated as transfers to this "bank" account.

HI Peter

Without reading the whole thread, Paul is correct in that the bank rec would never 'look' for this kind of thing - it's not how bookkeeping works.

The new divi tool in Clear Books is great as it provides the relevant supporting documentation. However, if rec'ing the payment to a bill is more important to you just don't use the tool and instead create a bill like presumably you used to.

"CB does not recognise the dividend as a bill and the bank rec is only designed to look for them." So why don't you change the design so that it can look for any type of liability instead of limiting it to just purchase invoices.

Hi Peter - that's exactly what I'm saying. There may be many examples of debts being owed outside the purchases (bills) function, Corporation tax is an obvious one, then there's directors', bank (or any other) loans, finance agreements or even PAYE & VAT debts if these are entered manually from another system. So when you hit a payment to HMRC for the corporation tax or say Class 1a NIC liability, there is no bill to match it to, you have to put the payment to the appropriate debt or expense account.

CB does not recognise the dividend as a bill and the bank rec is only designed to look for them.

That doesn't really explain why the bank rec import facility doesn't recognise that there is a dividend due to the shareholder and allow for it to be matched. You seem to be saying that a purchase isn't created anymore and so it can't. Why cant it look for outstanding purchases OR outstanding dividend payments to match to??

Hi Peter - Yes you are correct - what used to happen is that the system would generate a bill, however now the process is to create a journal - this was a request from accountants to make accounting at year end a lot less complex.

You could still manually create a bill if you wanted to and code this to the shareholder dividend account - when you import your statement you could then link the payment to this unpaid bill. However, I would recommend just explaining the payment on the imported statement as described in my previous post.

I am not sure you got what I meant. If I make a supplier payment and then look to match that in the bank rec import it already knows that I have an outstanding transaction for that supplier because I have recorded the purchase. So why if I have recorded the dividend does it not know that there is an existing liability for that shareholder and allow me to match against it. That's what use to happen.

Yes sorry Peter, I'm not sure why it cuts off the dividend part of the name on some accounts and not others - I have asked our development team to investigate this.

Also I agree - when a shareholder is added it should set the dividend account code as the default code to be used for that shareholder contact. Hopefully the technical team will automate this in future, however, you can manually update for now if you head to Purchases>Suppliers and edit the shareholder contact:

file

Yes I have those but without the 'dividends' so not obvious. This seems to be a bit of a backward step and much more clumsy than before. If I select the Shareholder then I would have hoped to see the dividend liability there to match to as it used to be.

Hi Peter,

When a shareholder is created on the dividend tool it generates a new account on the Settings>Codes list - these accounts begin with the code number 8505001 and should be under the Dividend creditor account group (example below):

file

Do you have any accounts in this group?

Just as a side note - On some accounts I have noticed that the name of the codes seems to drop dividends at the end, so in my example above it would read just Own Michael.

I cannot see any (Joe Bloggs) dividends Accounts to use. When/how do these get created?

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